Sexual misconduct: Sexual inappropriateness is par for the course

Fortnum and Mason Window display, originally uploaded by Irish friend of Bill.

Sexual misconduct: Sexual inappropriateness is par for the course
At work
With friends
At meetings
Online
With Sponsees
Wherever

Sexual inappropriateness is par for the course and is actually quite normal if you know what I mean. Meaning I am not very surprised when I see it. I see no reason to make a big deal of it. Its human nature after all. What did you expect? Even KIDS can be inadvertently sexually inappropriate for gods sakes. Part of being a good parent is learning how to skillfully manage misplaced sexual behavior in children. Eg That some nudity or inadvertently sexual behaviors are best reserved for the privacy of ones room, as opposed to ! mealtimes. Or whatever. I'm sure you know what I mean. (Not bizarre overly sexual actions as a result of sexual abuse, just boundaries relating to nudity and physicality that kids are not aware of.)

Certainly with AA's they are very often off kilter with regard to their sexual instincts, because they are by and large compulsive creatures and so tend to keep going back to destructive behaviors again and again, thinking 'this time it will be different'. Of course this is delusional. Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. The area of sexual behaviors is no different. This is why SLAA is full of people who are unable to rein in their compulsive sexual acting out (affairs, casual sex etc) despite recurring damaging effects such as Hepatitis or whatever, losing significant relationships, to name but a few.

In AA this inappropriateness can take many forms. At its most extreme this will involve rape of a newcomer woman by a longer time sober AA member posing as a trusted ally to the new female.

Less extreme, a 'consensual' sexual affair with a very vulnerable new woman by a longer time sober AA member who sees the affair in an utterly different light later in recovery. This is what we call 'thirteen stepping'.

Less extreme. Sexual irresponsibility between those that are not new but are just plain compulsive. That would involve affairs and betrayal of their significant others, possibly disease and unwanted pregnancy to boot.

Next: the openly verbalized sexualization of friendship by one person which is out of step with the sexual intentions of the other. Ie one is reading this as a sexualized friendship, and the other isn't.

I am afraid to say I have heard of all these scenarios.

And last but not least, This one is not a problem as such, but one I prefer to not have to deal with. This is the NON-verbalized sexualisation of friendship by one person which is out of step with the sexual intentions of the other. Ie one is reading this as a sexualized friendship, and the other isnt.
This is very common and arises as a by product of friendships. If I find the other persons sexual interest ? 'slimy' for want of a better word, I will not make time for that person even if their words and actions contain no openly culpable act of Sexual inappropriateness. They are not at 'fault', as such. Its just I find their company a bit 'slimy', and their reasons for wanting to maintain the friendship somewhat hypocritical. Ie they have an undisclosed or unacknowledged sexual interest which is not mentioned. This is 'their stuff', and is no big deal, its just I prefer not to be around it unless I have to. To some degree there will always be sexual tension in friendships, so to bar all such interactions would mean you avoided just about everyone! We all have sexual instincts, so it is entirely a personal matter at which point one decides the EXTENT of non-verbalized sexual attention one feels comfortable with. I can find sexual interest a bit intrusive. ? Or something. I don't really analyze it. I just do what is comfortable for me.
Disclosed sexual interest is not 'slimy' in that it is open and guiltless, but I would avoid that one too as I prefer not to be pestered by inappropriate requests.
BTW having spent at least 3yrs up to my neck in study, work and other commitments, that does not mean that when I have no free time, that the cause is this! The longer you are sober the more protective you get of your free time, and I am no different. So don't assume that my absence means there is a sexual subtext behind it all :)

So there you go. The whole bandwidth of sexual ? weirdness. The stuff people try to avoid anyway...
Just get used to the idea that most are very disappointing when it comes to the way in which they manage their closest relationships with respect to their sexual instincts, and you will not be too far off. :)
Sorry to puncture your idealism of AA and human nature generally, but there you have it. Who said human nature was flattering? It isnt! Its very ego puncturing. And it stays that way no matter how long sober you are. The skill is in how you manage it, so that you do not harm others. Until you do step 8 it is hard to grasp what harming others means to any great extent.

And no, not that it matters, but I have not been involved with an AA member. Ever. The ones that appeared on my 'radar' always looked a bit too ? Crazy to me. Probably because they were. Bless em. Besides, I much prefer non alcoholics. Who knows? Perhaps I will meet an AA I feel inclined to become involved with? ..but as yet that has not happened. Not even when I was very, ! very new. Non alcoholics always seem much more appealing. Certainly a LOT more sane by comparison. To me anyway. Plus I have heard many ! horror stories of AA relationships. Far !!! more than I would have liked to..
PS This does NOT mean that I think all non-alcoholics are incapable of having mental problems. Of !! course they can. One has to use ones common sense in these matters.

Oh yes and don't assume that you have the moral high ground if you have managed to avoid various affairs, diseases and ! whatever. It is just as morally culpable to be repressed as is it is to indulge destructive behaviors. Sexual repression can be just as destructive in the long term. So no cozy moral hilltop to view this sorry mess from I'm afraid :)

Right well I'm off. I have scary written submissions to do!!
Have a fabulous Sunday. It is gorgeous over here thank god :)

Disappointing return to 'regular' meetings..

LondonTreeJune09, originally uploaded by Irish friend of Bill.

I thought I should write because I haven't for awhile.
I'm still supposed to be doing important paperwork due end of June and July, so I feel obligated with various fairly dreary and difficult tasks. They never really go away.
I haven't looked around much for new women to sponsor, but the few I did meet did not seem too interested. Either they have sponsors or they are giggling round the under 5yrs males in AA who look like AA has become a useful resource when it comes to picking up women. Whatever. I haven't bothered to find out one way or another, but as I hear of new women getting pregnant and seeking abortions, and worse.. I generally assume that 13th stepping is alive and well across most of AA.
I'm not much good with giggly women, it has to be said. Thankfully I know just enough women who have been around longer to not have to listen to it very much.
Its a bit depressing seeing the state of AA one way or another. The people who show up in different meetings asking for money so that people will not realize they do it every week, the 13th stepping, the lax and ineffective sponsorship, and of course the low recovery rate and high relapse rate. Very depressing. My experience tells me it is avoidable if they are willing to follow suggestions you see. That's why its hard to watch.
I haven't looked very hard to be honest, but I suppose I have been attending a meeting that is mostly very new people, and the sense of misery and despair is palpable. That and the chronic dependence on relationships.
So yeah I am a bit shocked by the degree of (what I see) as 'acceptable' negativity.
Perhaps if I invest in one meeting a bit I will start to see a different side or I can try to be a positive influence on the 13th stepping, relapse rate and general levels of anguish. Who knows.
But thing is. I know the only way I will see a real and satisfying change in an individual is if I sponsor them properly. Otherwise its very piecemeal.
I am not very motivated to look for new women to reject me in favor of some low life AA bloke on the pull, but I will carry on looking.

In theory one always learns something new about oneself, but I dislike rejection as much as the next alky. And I take great offence at being labeled (wordlessly of course) as some kind of man hater, because I do not recommend relationships with men in aa. Quite wrong. Never mind. The only reason that rankles is because I have yet to meet a woman who understood what the HELL I meant by that till they go out with a reasonably sane non alcoholic. Whatever. I'm not even going to even TRY to explain that one.
But alkys are pretty sick. Pretty maudlin, negative creatures. I much prefer people without the same kind of mental illness, albeit in remission. Nah.

Anyway. It just goes to show that I am wrong even about having nothing (apparently) to say. Quelle surprise!
Being wrong is pretty ordinary. So nothing new there.

Right well the sun is shining and I am off to burn 1000 cals in the gym :)
Have a nice Tuesday out there :)

Quality not Quantity: Old timer (? As far as I know.?.) shagging a 14 yr old girl. Allegedly.

Disillusionment: Sexual misconduct: ? AA ? Old timer (? 60 yrs old) having sexual relations with 14 year old, over a year or so . Allegedly.

When I talk about 'disappointing' or 'disillusionment'. it sounds rather mild mannered, doesn't it? Well the REALITY of 'disappointing' and 'disillusionment' is actually rather RAW and depressing!! To say the least!!!! Here's an example for you so you can get my drift.
Here's an example of something disillusioning and disappointing..

Its a story in the paper I read the other day.
I read about a guy I knew from AA AGES ago (18 years ago or something) who as far as I know stayed sober but I don't really know, as don't bump into him very often and even when I did see him regularly, I never made an effort to get to know him or talk to him.

Basically there are VERY FEW guys in AA that I speak to or get to know. Partly because there are SO MANY I wouldn't have the time even if I DID want to, and also because a lot of them are lonely and MISINTERPRET friendliness as sexual interest. Basically its just MUCH easier if I stick with the women..

Well anyway, he ALLLEGEDLY had sex with a 14 year old. Blah blah blah. Yeah also cleared of looking at kiddie porn for 'research purposes'. Yeah right.
Whatever. I don't think his name or the details are important. The only reason I mention this is because I saw it in the paper, and just beforehand was ? Moved to post about 'beware of aa old-timers full of s**t' yesterday. So you could say there was a bit of a theme going on there!!

So do you see !! WHY you should never just assume that just because someone has been sober for a long time that they must somehow be ? Less fallible, or less likely to be full of CRAP than anyone else????

See????? QUALITY NOT QUANTITY!!!!!!!
I think this case history makes that !! abundantly clear.

Anyway, before you all start frothing at the mouth and despairing as to the general plight of the human condition nowadays, FIRSTLY
I've seen a TON of sexual misconduct by old timers since I've been in AA, so this is NOTHING NEW to me. Its called 13th stepping and it happens ALL THE TIME. AA has its fair share of (what I call) 'sexual predators' who look out for very new bewildered, and very impressionable new girls to get off with, after spouting a few aa clichés and what have you.
Its EASY. Like shooting fish in a barrel. So it is an ongoing problem. Rather than whinge about it, I try to be part of the solution and 'brief' new women of this inherent risk AS SOON AS THEY COME TO MEETINGS. Whatever. That all I can do really. I can't 'change' the men's behavior, so I try to protect the women instead.

By the way I DO NOT HATE GUYS. Just in case you are thinking that. I have been very lucky in getting to know some really nice people in aa, but I have to admit, that by and large I am MUCH more 'at home' with people who are NOT alcoholics. Generally. That's a very personal thing, but its just how I feel. I feel more comfortable with non alcoholics. I RELATE more to alcoholics, but I would rather be with NON alcoholics.
Right I'm off.. Again. !